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2/5 AA facing turn donk on wet board

TDF Posts: 1,130Subscriber
edited November -1 in NLHE Strategy Discussion
Villain is experienced recreational player. He pays attention to the game and pot sizes. He’s very loose preflop but not making huge mistakes postflop.
Previously played hand:
Villain(1000) limps MP, Hero(500) on his left opens to 25 with AhTd, all fold, Villain calls.
Ad5c9c (55) Villain checks, Hero checks
2s (55) Villain bets 35. Hero calls
6c (125) Villain bets 80. Hero calls
Villain shows 8c9d, says “Nice check on the flop”.

Hand:
Villain(1000) limps MP, Hero(700) on his left opens to 25 with AhAd, BTN calls, blinds fold, Villain calls.
Jc9c2s (80) Villain checks, Hero bets 65, BTN folds, Villain calls
5s (210) Villain bets 115. Hero?
What’s our plan for different rivers?

Comments

  • This spot is one of the places where I have been experimenting with raise folding the turn. If you make it say $315 all Js will call you and people arent sophisticated enough to bet 3 bet draws on the turn. You can use the fact that he thinks you'll never fold after raising against him. Only thing he may go nuts with is Jc Xc

    Bart
  • chilidog Posts: 2,427Subscriber
    Bart- I think you meant JXss ...?
    I was in a similar spot the other day where an old guy (movember champ btw) raised my flop cbet on Ks9d4s and continued with a pretty big bet on the 8o turn. I just called with AA ott, but after the hand, I think I should have either crai ott , or c/c turn and lead river. His range of better hands is 99 and 44 only and I have to be willing to stack off. The main factor that made me go into c/c mode was his image as an old dude. Anyway, I forget what my point was other than I agree that raise / folding for value with a strong one pair hand is good stuff and should be worked into our value town strategy.
  • Fish Fryer Posts: 161Member
    TDF said

    Villain is experienced recreational player. He pays attention to the game and pot sizes. He’s very loose preflop but not making huge mistakes postflop.
    Previously played hand:
    Villain(1000) limps MP, Hero(500) on his left opens to 25 with AhTd, all fold, Villain calls.
    Ad5c9c (55) Villain checks, Hero checks
    2s (55) Villain bets 35. Hero calls
    6c (125) Villain bets 80. Hero calls
    Villain shows 8c9d, says “Nice check on the flop”.

    Hand:
    Villain(1000) limps MP, Hero(700) on his left opens to 25 with AhAd, BTN calls, blinds fold, Villain calls.
    Jc9c2s (80) Villain checks, Hero bets 65, BTN folds, Villain calls
    5s (210) Villain bets 115. Hero?
    What’s our plan for different rivers?
    I think you have two choices here and I'm really not sure which is better. You can call with the intention of calling a reasonable river bet or you can raise with the intention of folding to a shove and either checking back the river or a thin value bet on the river. I'd probably err on the side of raising the turn with the intention of folding to a shove. I just don't like calling river bets from V's in this spot.
  • chilidog Posts: 2,427Subscriber
    Raise turn to $285 (fold to shove). Vbet non Js/non spade rivers if he checks. If V bets river on non-scary cards, eval his sizing and call blockerish sizings, fold to shoves or other large bets.

    Edit: what if I'm not a "math" player and can't solve the tricky problems required to make a post?
  • Zach Z-H said
    TDF said

    Villain is experienced recreational player. He pays attention to the game and pot sizes. He’s very loose preflop but not making huge mistakes postflop.
    Previously played hand:
    Villain(1000) limps MP, Hero(500) on his left opens to 25 with AhTd, all fold, Villain calls.
    Ad5c9c (55) Villain checks, Hero checks
    2s (55) Villain bets 35. Hero calls
    6c (125) Villain bets 80. Hero calls
    Villain shows 8c9d, says “Nice check on the flop”.

    Hand:
    Villain(1000) limps MP, Hero(700) on his left opens to 25 with AhAd, BTN calls, blinds fold, Villain calls.
    Jc9c2s (80) Villain checks, Hero bets 65, BTN folds, Villain calls
    5s (210) Villain bets 115. Hero?
    What’s our plan for different rivers?
    I think you have two choices here and I'm really not sure which is better. You can call with the intention of calling a reasonable river bet or you can raise with the intention of folding to a shove and either checking back the river or a thin value bet on the river. I'd probably err on the side of raising the turn with the intention of folding to a shove. I just don't like calling river bets from V's in this spot.
    Yes indeed I meant Js xs

    Bart
  • ThehammahThehammah Posts: 7,085Subscriber
    Zach Z-H said
    TDF said

    Villain is experienced recreational player. He pays attention to the game and pot sizes. He’s very loose preflop but not making huge mistakes postflop.
    Previously played hand:
    Villain(1000) limps MP, Hero(500) on his left opens to 25 with AhTd, all fold, Villain calls.
    Ad5c9c (55) Villain checks, Hero checks
    2s (55) Villain bets 35. Hero calls
    6c (125) Villain bets 80. Hero calls
    Villain shows 8c9d, says “Nice check on the flop”.

    Hand:
    Villain(1000) limps MP, Hero(700) on his left opens to 25 with AhAd, BTN calls, blinds fold, Villain calls.
    Jc9c2s (80) Villain checks, Hero bets 65, BTN folds, Villain calls
    5s (210) Villain bets 115. Hero?
    What’s our plan for different rivers?
    I think you have two choices here and I'm really not sure which is better. You can call with the intention of calling a reasonable river bet or you can raise with the intention of folding to a shove and either checking back the river or a thin value bet on the river. I'd probably err on the side of raising the turn with the intention of folding to a shove. I just don't like calling river bets from V's in this spot.
    Doesn't this smell like either "I have a J and I am afraid to check and pay off a big bet" or " I am on a draw and I am afraid of having to pay off a big bet"?

    If the villain really had a big hand I think he would go for a check raise.. or would have raised the flop.. I think you need to raise this guy on the turn.. but with an amount that you can fold if he shoves.. so the sizing is important..

    Wendy
  • SkinnybrownSkinnybrown Posts: 286Member
    Raise more pre flop
  • TDF Posts: 1,130Subscriber
    Skinnybrown said
    Raise more pre flop
    I'm sorry but this is lol bad. You might want to work on this aspect of your understanding of the game.
  • Yeah, pre is fine. I actually don't like bombing it pre because keeping the SPRs low gives me even more of an advantage post flop. While people do make huge preflop mistakes, their mistakes post flop are enormous.
  • ThehammahThehammah Posts: 7,085Subscriber
    TDF said
    Skinnybrown said
    Raise more pre flop
    I'm sorry but this is lol bad. You might want to work on this aspect of your understanding of the game.
    Come on TDF.. If you want to troll please feel free to post as often as you like on 2+2. We really want this forum to have a free flow of views back and forth. You can let other know WHY you think a play isnt the best without the insult.

    We want to learn from each other. not tear each other down.

    Wendy
  • TDF Posts: 1,130Subscriber
    Wendy, you're right. I apologise.
  • SkinnybrownSkinnybrown Posts: 286Member
    Dear Wendy,

    You are an extremely nice person which is very very rare in today's society.

    Having these forums be respectful is a major selling point to the site imo.

    Dear TDF,

    Appology accepted. Absolutely no worries brother. However, I do agree with the technical aspect of your above comment ;)
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