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1000 th post. What can I say.. I always was a teacher's pet

ThehammahThehammah Posts: 7,085Subscriber
So chili asked me to make some observations of the 20/40 EO game at the bike. so here they are:

1) So far by a far margin I have made the most $$ in the stud 8 rounds. I play tight as Bart has suggested due to the small ante ($3) relative to the blinds and so far so good.

2) Most of the money is made in the omaha rounds . These are always multiway and generally there is a raise. The thing is so far the two biggest winners in these rounds of the regs play fairly loose. Its so antithetical to everything we have ever learned in Omaha.. Play for nuts and there are some hands worth raising and some hands not. These two play very different but I am beginning to wonder that in loose relatively passive games can you really play more aggressive with certain types of hands that are not "premium" and win big?

Ex. All I do is miss my nut nut draws..

So "Joe" is a young asian kid who specializes in Omaha and he is VERY aggressive. Raises virtually every button and likes to play a wide variety of hands. the hand goes 4 ways and I have AJ24 ds and I call from the SB. Against Joes range I could threebet but being out of position is just really tough because he WILL represent anything if you check so building a big pot in my mind really doesnt do any good. I stick with value..

Flop K 35.. This is just a monster and I decide to go ahead and bet. I want to bet into Joe since most players will check to the raiser and I want to build a pot with such equity. I am suited to the ace in spades and there is one spade and i have J high hearts and there is one heart.. I bet everyone calls Joe raises I threebet another player in between caps it and everyone calls

Turn 9 hearts. So now I have the jack high flush draw and uncounterfeitable low wrap I go ahead and bet again. Now a field player raises and I assume she has hit the 9 some how ..probably two pair. everyone calls.

River os 10.. so sick.. I brick everything.. everyone checks to a field player who for the first time bets at the pot and Joe calls..everyone else folds.. Joe has 9924 suited to the heart.. and the guy that scoops a now $1500 pot has QQJT no suits.. omg how did he get to the river and hit his gin card.. It turns out that another player had pocket Ts for the sucker end of the straight and this guy hit a 1 outer to scoop this ginourmous pot..

This is just an example but I have seen Joe play JJ64 for a raise and the other big winner Suzie play hands like T245 ds or 8634 ds and win big pots..

When I played this past sunday I won almost $1500 in the stud rounds but lost $2100 in the omaha rounds. mainly because I bricked every big nut low drawing hands. So I am going to reconsider playing uber tight and aggressive and maybe open up a bit near the button and especially if I have low straight card rundowns and limp a bit more in ep with A2xx hands and pretty much only raise with high pair and good low hands.. Like AA2x and the like. Even though I might not scoop as many pots the pots themselves are generally so large that even winning half is many times over $200 and a few pots like that thoughout the session should really help.

I have a Bovada account where I practice and if you are serious about getting better I strongly suggest you get an online account to get hands in. You might not ever be able to cash out but who cares if you real purpose is to get in the volume and you dont have a good game local to play.

wwkisscoolthumb

Comments

  • NicholasK Posts: 237Member
    Great post, congrats on the 1k post.thumb

    There are so many theoretical ways to play O8 that it seems like a gold mine for someone to be able to spot the optimal lines for many types of games and to be adaptable. I'll get a bovada account for the practice and perhaps we can swap HH to study more effectively. I've been actively experimenting with a few "garbage" rundown hands for the same purpose.

    My game plays so passively preflop I can expect to get through with limping 80% of the time, which gives me the opportunity to call preflop in position (or my BB) with hands like K,Q,J,9 looking for simply non low flop wraps. Part of the trick is to recognize that your FD have about as much value as 45 for low on a board of A28. As weird as it sounds, through my limited sample size it has worked.. I think it's only been profitable because I've gotten 6 or 7/1 odds on the preflop call and they're easy hands to fold when you miss the flop. I'm really looking forward to working on the game with you in the future.
  • BartBart Posts: 5,820AdministratorLeadPro
    Wendy,

    I can't tell you how important accurate hand recall is if you want to improve your game. Your example up top here just doesn't make a lot of sense to me and something has got to be out of whack. On the turn--a field player raises when the 9 appears and Joe just calls with 9924? Seems highly unlikely he is scared that the field raiser has KKK and was just calling along on the flop? Plus he has 24, so 2nd set with and open ended straight draw. If this guy is any type of player he would be jamming the turn. And that same field player that raised when the 9 appeared now folds to one bet when the unknown leads the river?

    I am not picking on you and I really want to help you with your game. I have been consistently beating 75-150 O8 for years at the series and I am telling you that correct hand recall is absolutely paramount if you want to get better in the game. One other thing K359T you say that a guy has TT for sucker straight but QJ is the only straight out there. I think a good exercise for you is to try and recreate this hand again.

    Bart
  • chilidog Posts: 2,427Subscriber
    i like the concept of being a well rounded poker player. i have therefore spent some time in the past few months playing omaha8 in various card rooms. i'd like to learn stud and stud8 as well, but there just aren't live games near me.

    here are a few observations on omaha8:

    position, while a key concept in poker, is just not as important in limit structures vs big bet games.
    it seems like preflop can be played a bit looser, AS LONG AS YOU CAN MAINTAIN DISCIPLINE POST FLOP.
    be willing to build pots with high only hands when a bunch of people limp in.
    post flop, consider your possibility to scoop when you are continuing in a pot.
    occasionally A2J7r type hands can be folded, especially when facing a raise.
    consider raising with the bare nut low on the river when the nut low is an odd-ish combo like 52, 53, or 42.
    do not call a raise with A4Q9 or similar. pretty tough to scoop.



    i would like to get some more hands in and be able to learn other games online, but i have 2 kids now......oh yeah, and a job!
  • ThehammahThehammah Posts: 7,085Subscriber
    Chili

    I work too.. and I am finding on my last two trips that I would rather stay in the room and work on my omaha game than goto the local casino that only has NL.. I just wish I had remembered the above hand correctly. After I wrote it I realized that joe would have definitely raised with the set. What I am planning on doing is to start keeping track of what he plays in what pos as starting hands.

    I agree that if you can fold say third nut low draw no redraw (like st or flush) then calling for one bet is ok if its a multiway pot. I am still raising in pos with premium low hands ..mainly to build a pot pre when players are still willing to put more money in the pot.

    I also experimented last night online with hands like A high suited cards and straight run downs but not say KQT but TJ9 etc.. Scooping is not going to be likely but again if I can chop a good size pot I am still making money. Of course this hand I feel should only be played again in position against a limp with at least one or two limpers in front of me.

    So I will continue to play around a bit with these concepts and hopefully can improve my results in the O8 rounds as I feel I am doing ok in the stud 8 rounds.. If you are ever in LA for work.

    Wendy
  • chilidog Posts: 2,427Subscriber
    One other thought I had that might apply more to the lower limits of O8:

    Raising wide pre helps keep your ranges wide and helps to get paid off later. Ive gotten some crazy call downs and overcalls when there is just a speck of doubt whether i have "it". The converse is the uber nits who should never get action when they bet (or especially raise). Of course they still get action at the lower levels, but more observant opponents will adjust.
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