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Question for Bart (and others) changing stakes

Fish Fryer Posts: 161Member
edited November -1 in NLHE Strategy Discussion
Since you mentioned recently that you have been playing much more of the 300-1k 5/5 game as opposed to the 5/10 game, I'm wondering if you could take a few minutes and describe the differences you see in how you approach each game?

I think many of us are in a position where we want to make the jump up in limits and occasionally take shots with mixed results, but you are in a somewhat unique position to have success in a larger game(s) and then transition to a smaller game. I think it would be an interesting view how you have had to adjust your game moving to a smaller game with less thinking opponents, fancy plays etc...

Of course, I'd be ecstatic to read anyone's opinion on this. I just think it sounds interesting,

zach

Comments

  • Zach,

    I think overall I have had to play MUCH MUCH tighter from upfront. Depending on the table I realize that cbets get through fields much less and I tend to just bet my hand for value. I do think there is ample opportunity to isolate, however, and i see a ton of ridiculous late postion open limps. It reminds me of videos that Leatherass did like 5 years ago. Limping is like free money.

    I also have had to pay super close attention to SPR as the avg open is larger in relation to the blinds and the stack sizes tend to be smaller. I'm going to go over this hand this week in the podcast:

    Eff $280.
    1 Limps, fishy guy makes it $35 from M2 I 3 bet to $80 with As Ks, guy calls. POT $160.

    FLOP K72r he checks. I check back.

    Turn 5cc. He bets $110, I call.

    River 8. He moves all in. I call, he shows AQ.

    With the SPRs being so small and people not understanding the concept that someone could be checking back 1 pair there are some trappy lines that you can take vs bad players.

    Bart
  • grindbler Posts: 131Member
    playing lower stakes well becomes much more about discipline than about getting overly involved in playing postable hands where we are leveling/ FPSing/ in an interesting spot. It's going to be more boring, and it's more show-down oriented, so therefore may require greater patience.
    shorter stacks, and show down monkeys means its going to be harder to manufacture wins without having it.

    At 5/5 if str8forward play is still getting the $ in the game, making more advanced plays that might be viable in a game where str8forward play doesnt still get the $ seems unnecessary as far as trying to be as profitable as possible.
    because of the low par of play at lower stakes there might be even more value in observing opponents, and in so being able to make not-by-the-book plays against them to take advantage of whatever their particular weak tendencies are. ie. overbetting when you know they are never folding. you cant just default to how you would play in a tougher game, where ppl are playing more or less decently. sometimes at low stakes, we can make the mistake of not fathoming exactly how badly opponents play, and can pass up on mad value at times by auto-piloting 'correctly' against them...

    there is no doubt a different kind of challenge in playing against bad clueless players, its going to be in making certain adjustments that would sometimes seem odd fundamentally if they were in a normal context with players who are more literate-to-the-game
    I've heard that its not worth observing bad players because you already know how they play; they play like a donkey.
    while there is an element of truth in that, still, one donkey can play and think about AK in one way, another in another way. it pays to know the difference, imo.
  • Fish Fryer Posts: 161Member
    Bart said

    Zach,

    I think overall I have had to play MUCH MUCH tighter from upfront. Depending on the table I realize that cbets get through fields much less and I tend to just bet my hand for value. I do think there is ample opportunity to isolate, however, and i see a ton of ridiculous late postion open limps. It reminds me of videos that Leatherass did like 5 years ago. Limping is like free money.

    I also have had to pay super close attention to SPR as the avg open is larger in relation to the blinds and the stack sizes tend to be smaller. I'm going to go over this hand this week in the podcast:

    Eff $280.
    1 Limps, fishy guy makes it $35 from M2 I 3 bet to $80 with As Ks, guy calls. POT $160.

    FLOP K72r he checks. I check back.

    Turn 5cc. He bets $110, I call.

    River 8. He moves all in. I call, he shows AQ.

    With the SPRs being so small and people not understanding the concept that someone could be checking back 1 pair there are some trappy lines that you can take vs bad players.

    Bart
    Thanks Bart. That's an interesting concept of trapping with TPTK type hands and one I haven't thought about. I would assume it is really only working in situations where V's stack is short and your value-based bet gets an instant fold?

    If you'd prefer not to discuss this hand until after the show comes out - no problem.

    I'm curious what the V's stack would have to be for you to draw the line at checking back TPTK here and value betting the hand? This is a spot where I have noticed I am leaking money as a misuse of SPR/commitment has me betting flops and turns with a hand that I really don't want to get raised with, but think I am ahead. I suspect that there are so few cards that hit what I perceive the V's range to be that I am ok to check back far more than I am doing, and I think that has become a significant leak in my game. I am setting up V's to check raise the turn and put me in a spot where I am in no man's land.
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