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AKo button v SB v BB

Collecting_Tax Posts: 177Subscriber
edited November -1 in NLHE Strategy Discussion
2/5nl

$600 effective

Hero (BB) - getting killed, bad losing image.

Villain 1 (button) - short stacked, $70, sat short, lost most money in first hand played.

Villain 2 (SB) - Has everyone covered, went on a heater as soon as he sat. Asian under 30. he is quasi competent but definitely spewy.

MP raises to $20
HJ calls
Button shoves $70
SB 4bets to $130
Hero (BB) AKo thinks for a bit and cold calls
MP and HJ fold

($370) 2s 4c Kh

Villain bets $100 pretty quickly into a $120 side pot.
Hero calls

($570) 2s 4c Kh As

Villain shoves
Hero??

So did i just totally botch this hand? Should i have played it any different up to this point? Once we get here can i profitably call to chop? obv preflop villain could be doing this with a really wide range including hands that i dominate so i just dont think folding is ever an option against this opponent. I guess i could have cold 5 bet/folded??? am i even deep enough to do that here? Then on the flop i dont think i can fold here either at this point but once the turn shows up and he still shoves my head starts to spin. I lose to one combo each of AA and KK and chop with the other four combos of AK. I suppose in retrospect he may have been isoing pre with 22 or 44 but i really think that should be discounted heavily. All thoughts appreciated. thanks.

Comments

  • chilidog Posts: 2,427Subscriber
    Ummmmm, call. It is unlikely but marginally possible he can be shoving worse for value if he has a light iso range that includes AQ and AJ (along with the flop cbet that would be unusual, but not impossible with Ace high - the side pot is worth winning). Is it possible he iso's with A4/A2 suited?

    U have top 2 pair that cannot be counterfitted in a 3bet pot with like 74 BBs effective ott. Yeah, most likely you are chopping, but can't fold now.
  • whofox Posts: 25Subscriber
    If you read him as spewy and semi competent then definitely call. Spewey + semi competent = fancy play syndrome and he could be using the A and K as scare cards even though that's pretty stupid given the preflop action unless he knows you can fold a hand. He might have eliminated AA and KK from your range since you didn't jam preflop and so he could be making a play knowing that you could maybe fold AK if he thinks you're a decent player. So just call and hope for the best.
  • whatsyourplay? Posts: 752Member
    I think you have to decide pre if you want to go with the hand or not. Based on this decision, you should either 5bet to get it in, or fold. Flattcalling 130 with 470 behind can't be the best play. AK really needs to see five cards. It would be different with QQ.
  • Collecting_Tax Posts: 177Subscriber
    I just hate the idea of 5bet shoving here though. I feel like when i do i am only getting called when I am destroyed and folding out everything else. If i was deeper this would have been easier.
  • whatsyourplay? Posts: 752Member
    Jon, I see what you are saying. It is true that only better hands will call most of the time. However, you sometimes will fold out JJ, QQ and maybe AK, which is great. Moreover, both AA and KK are less likely since you hold two of those cards.
    Also, with so much money in the pot already, you don't mind to win the hand preflop. And even against KK you have some equity.

    I just think you'll make significant mistakes (i.e. either loose more or win less) by flattcalling. What do you do on a low flop when facing a cbet? Are you happy when facing a bet on Kxx?
    In the end, you might fold against the same hand or JJ/QQ, or you might hit and have villain shut down postflop.
  • Mike Posts: 371Member
    Just get it in PF. You are rarely gonna be absolutly crushed (he has aces) even if he has kings you still have 30% equity.

    As played you have to call it off.
  • UntreatableFPS Posts: 1,004Subscriber
    When I want to reduce variance, I fold pre in this situation. When I'm playing normal-higher variance, I get it in pre against this kind of player.

    As played, when you call a big bet in a protected 3-bet pot on the flop, could you ask for a better turn? You can't fold if you're flatting the 3-bet pre to hit the flop and you get this kind of flop and turn.
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