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The Limon Show No.58: Matt Savage

Craig Posts: 669Administrator
edited February 2015 in The Limon Show podcast
This week Limon interviews the tournament director of the WPT, Matt Savage. They talk about reentry tournaments, whether long events are actually hurting the cash games, overall tournament hold in casinos and round the conversation off with Limon discussing what he says should be the legal requirement of divulging staking pieces.

Episode posts at 11am PT.

http://www.crushlivepoker.com/podcasts/free-matt-savage
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  • totsdtftotsdtf Posts: 156Subscriber
    edited February 2015

    matt savage

    image
  • BartBart Posts: 5,723AdministratorLeadPro
    edited February 2015
    Not sure what that photo means.

    Matt is one of the good guys in poker--and there really aren't many of them. I think it was great that he agreed to come on the podcast and I am very thankful. It really turned out to be one of my favorite #Seshs.

    I love the banter between two guys who obviously "get it" and have been around for so long. There aren't many that have survived pre and post poker boom and to have both these guys go back and forth about tourney vs cash game topics was a real treat.


    Bart
  • iLikeCaliDonksiLikeCaliDonks Posts: 932Troll
    "Good guys" in poker. Tired of hearing that. The guy said I suck at poker let me find a way to make money. Now hes rich off recreational players and he never had to stack then. Im quite jealous.

  • MikeG Posts: 989Subscriber
    Good show.

    Abe's best point continues to be his push for all partnerships being disclosed. I agree this is a huge problem that must be addressed.

    I still am not convinced that tournaments hurt poker. In th short run they seem to help (look at cash games at CC right now compared to bike). It's harder to tell about te long term.

    Abe attempts to address this by suggesting poker was as good or better 15 years ago. It's true that tournaments have changed over that tune frame, but we've also seen 2+2, a million books, training sites, etc that have taught people how to play. Why blame tournaments?

    The only argument I heard was that $$ get taken out of tournaments, never to return. On the contrary, I think entire cash games are built on tourney donks who bink a nice score (think J.Gold). If anything, it pushes money up the poker ladder (big game players benefit disproportionately), which Limon is generally a fan of.

    Just my two cents.
  • Cross807 Posts: 8Subscriber
    Really good episode overall imo. I 150% agree with Limon's stance on if players have a corresponding financial interest in the outcome of hands, it must be disclosed (aka I want to know) in Tourneys and ESP in cash games.

    Abe you really need to attend that summit/meeting in Vegas Matt was talking about and make your arguments. You have a good way of making points and backing them up and most importantly getting through to people who have some common sense in them.
  • PocketAceTrader782 Posts: 439Subscriber
    edited February 2015
    Great show Limon and great guest. Let me first say I am about a 99.9% cash game player. I rarely play in Tournaments except for maybe a couple during the WSOP. However, in the card room I play primarily (Horseshoe Hammond) the games are always really good, but they are even better when the WSOP circuit event or the CHicago Poker Classic is in town.

    I agree that unlimited re buy events are horrible for the poker economy and cash games. However, a lot of the re entry events in my area are structured in a way such as this: If you bust out of Day 1A, you have to come back the following day to re buy into Day 1B. Therefore, there are a lot of Tourny Donks (for lack of a better word) that will bust out of one flight, play cash. Come back the next day and the next and let the same cycle repeat itself. That helps the games.

    Carmine
  • BartBart Posts: 5,723AdministratorLeadPro
    Problem is that the Bike they have multi-flight per day reentry tournaments. Sometimes up to 4 flight a day. Those guys never even go into the cash game room.

    Bart
  • iLikeCaliDonksiLikeCaliDonks Posts: 932Troll
    Iron Man Tournaments Best Idea ainec.
  • MikeG Posts: 989Subscriber
    Claiming that quantum reload is bad is not the same thing as saying that tournaments are killing poker.
  • BartBart Posts: 5,723AdministratorLeadPro
    iLikeCaliDonks said:
    "Good guys" in poker. Tired of hearing that. The guy said I suck at poker let me find a way to make money. Now hes rich off recreational players and he never had to stack then. Im quite jealous.

    Cali--listen to this show- http://www.crushlivepoker.com/podcasts/what-is-poker

    Isn't this the entire goal of poker? I'd take Matt's situation over most others. Who cares if he didn't make his $$ from playing poker?
  • iLikeCaliDonksiLikeCaliDonks Posts: 932Troll
    Bart said:
    iLikeCaliDonks said:
    "Good guys" in poker. Tired of hearing that. The guy said I suck at poker let me find a way to make money. Now hes rich off recreational players and he never had to stack then. Im quite jealous.

    Cali--listen to this show- http://www.crushlivepoker.com/podcasts/what-is-poker

    Isn't this the entire goal of poker? I'd take Matt's situation over most others. Who cares if he didn't make his $$ from playing poker?
    I said im jealous. Its a wonderful situation. Wish I could do something in poker to make great money.
  • iLikeCaliDonksiLikeCaliDonks Posts: 932Troll
    I remember that podcast bart. I started my free name around that time.

    3mins and it cut off lol. But I definitely get your point. My point is that im jealous.
  • MikeG Posts: 989Subscriber
    Back in the day it used to be cool for 21 year olds with nothing going on to hire personal assistants and pay them too much. Maybe you could do that!
  • totsdtftotsdtf Posts: 156Subscriber
    edited February 2015
    Bart said:
    Cali--listen to this show- http://www.crushlivepoker.com/podcasts/what-is-poker

    Isn't this the entire goal of poker? I'd take Matt's situation over most others. Who cares if he didn't make his $$ from playing poker?
    if poker leads you to something else that's more stable income, enough money for what you need, and that you're happy doing, then you have won in the game of life (or at least a big part of it), not just poker.

    grinding cash games is for those of us who are either too miserable doing other things that meet our financial needs or don't have the ability to.
  • CajunDragonCajunDragon Posts: 167Member
    edited February 2015
    > who "get it"

    The only thing I don't think Matt gets is the fact that really, there is *no* such thing as a traveling tournament pro who is self sustaining (not backed or sponsored). I'm sure Matt's a really smart guy but he's just never played for a living and I believe Limon is 100% right in this case. I have been deeply involved in the tournament scene in Vegas and other areas. Just one stop can cost you over $2000. Many friends of mine have had big scores... now they're all broke and begging for money on 2p2 and twitter. Some of them have immense skill (some are just gambling idiots) but they can't over come the variance and expenses. The only way to play mtts for a living is online and with massive volume!

    The only true traveling pros I know of are the cash game grinders who chase the idiot tournament players around to each stop and play with them after they bust their donkaments.
  • iLikeCaliDonksiLikeCaliDonks Posts: 932Troll
    Isnt that everyone's donkament story. They get staked once win a small tournament and always borrowing to play more tournament's.

    I know this guy biggest donkey. Style is a 70-20 in tournament's. Has tons of people backing him off one score lmao.
  • iLikeCaliDonksiLikeCaliDonks Posts: 932Troll
    edited February 2015
    Says hes better then me. Lmfao
  • Johnny_UtahJohnny_Utah Posts: 402Subscriber
    iLikeCaliDonks said:
    "Good guys" in poker. Tired of hearing that. The guy said I suck at poker let me find a way to make money. Now hes rich off recreational players and he never had to stack then. Im quite jealous.

    There are a lot of "non good guys" in Poker, Cali. Poker is well known for the scummy people and I think it's important to recognize "the good guys." Does it tilt you that I posted this?

    Hope everyone is well. Take care ILCD and run good man!
  • iLikeCaliDonksiLikeCaliDonks Posts: 932Troll
    Im saying that poker has a bad name in the mainstream cuz of scummy pros.

    Theres millions of "good guys" in poker. Look at most of the rec players. I mean I love these guys. Just good whole hearted people.

    Compare that to a tournament director. Its no question who the "good guys" really are.
  • iLikeCaliDonksiLikeCaliDonks Posts: 932Troll
    Johnny_Utah said:
    iLikeCaliDonks said:
    "Good guys" in poker. Tired of hearing that. The guy said I suck at poker let me find a way to make money. Now hes rich off recreational players and he never had to stack then. Im quite jealous.

    There are a lot of "non good guys" in Poker, Cali. Poker is well known for the scummy people and I think it's important to recognize "the good guys." Does it tilt you that I posted this?

    Hope everyone is well. Take care ILCD and run good man!
    And yes this post tilted me cuz its an captain obvious statement.

    Limon says it all the time. Im just tired of hearing all the bad shit. Wish we could push all the scum out of poker.

    But who would the poker community stake if we did that?

    Guys like me obviously who dont get a chance.
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