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A time to slow play a SET... or not?

CajunDragonCajunDragon Posts: 173Member
edited April 2015 in NLHE Strategy Discussion
I'm not a fan of slow playing but here's one that I played somewhat tricky.

Bellagio 1-3 $400 Effective Stacks

PRE: I called a $13 BU raise in the SB with 55 from a kid. It ended up being HU.
FLOP: Flop was 593r, I checked to him, He c-bet $20, I called.
TURN: 2d - Check/Check
RIVER: Ax - I checked/He bet $25/I raised him to $75 and he folded

Thoughts: It looked like he was in 'one in done' mode on this flop with overs like KQ,AX etc and I'd seen him C-bet flops then shut down to any action many times before... The turn was 2d. I checked , he checked back. River was an Ace. He seemed to perk up on that card and it meshes well with his raising range..so I decided to let him bet. I checked, he bet $25, I raised him to $75 and he folded.

In spots like this is it better to just bet the river? I'm not sure he was 90% to bet and for it to get checked back OTR is a disaster.

He complimented me on letting him catch up. Showed an ace and folded. I didn't write this one down immediately which is why suits are missing but there was no FD on the flop.'

P.S. Yes, this is Vegas... People fold a pair of aces raises *ALL* the time...sadly

Comments

  • willbert7willbert7 Posts: 26Subscriber
    I think you made the max and you gave him enough opportunity to lose more money, he clearly just did not have a strong hand. I prefer a check/raise on the river vs a good player, as opposed to a bet, as a bet only gets called by hands that might bet for value themselves, whereas a check, induces bluffs, value bets with any ace and light value bets like 66/77/88/T9/98, most of these hands fold to a river bet.
    If the villain is a bad player I would lead river for close to full pot as I don't see a bad player folding any ace and that way we maximise value.
  • reedmylipsreedmylips Posts: 1,145Subscriber
    I think another line could be a min or near min c/r on flop followed by lead small on turn and river. He c-bets to $20, you raise somewhere between $40-$50. Many villains will call there and float, if nothing else because they hate getting c/r, although this villain seems like the nittiest of nits.
  • DavidChan Posts: 1,208Pro
    edited April 2015
    Need more info on BTN Villain tendencies. I play a set in about 5 different ways postflop in this situation, and it all depends on how VIllain will play postflop.
  • ThehammahThehammah Posts: 7,086Subscriber
    edited April 2015
    Based on sizing I am going to go for a flop raise especially if this guy is a one and done player

    If he has something he will continue and I build a pot.

    If he doesnt he will fold and I make pretty much the same as if I had slowplayed

    I am not trying to get an extra $25 out of him when he rivers an ace. But stack him when he had an overpair. You cant do that if you dont build a pot


    I would potentially slowplay a set if its multiway and the board has even fewer draws on it. HU you just need to go for it
  • CajunDragonCajunDragon Posts: 173Member
    DavidChan said:
    Need more info on BTN Villain tendencies. I play a set in about 5 different ways postflop in this situation, and it all depends on how VIllain will play postflop.
    There is a pretty good subset of local 1-3 grinders at Bellagio. This kid was definately a winning player. I hadn't seen him make any big mistakes. He's sort of like me.. Bets flop. Gives up to resistance.. Can fold TPTK.. Pretty standard IMO.

    I've been trying to take notes during play of mistakes that players are making. The problem with Vegas is that once I get a set of notes that are useful, they usually bust, leave, go to a show, dinner.. the Rhino.. hehe :)

  • CajunDragonCajunDragon Posts: 173Member
    Thehammah said:
    I would potentially slowplay a set if its multiway and the board has even fewer draws on it. HU you just need to go for it
    I'm not sure I understand your thought process on slow playing a set if we are multi way vs HU. I always thought in the reverse.. Espically in 1-2/1-3. Multi way pots are generally spots I fast play my sets.. Mind you, I RARELY slow play sets.. this was just a special case do to villian tendencies.

    Caj
  • Dusty Posts: 233Subscriber
    Anyone like a large lead on the river , 66-75% to get at least a call from an ace that will fold to the CR?
  • ThehammahThehammah Posts: 7,086Subscriber
    CajunDragon said:
    Thehammah said:
    I would potentially slowplay a set if its multiway and the board has even fewer draws on it. HU you just need to go for it
    I'm not sure I understand your thought process on slow playing a set if we are multi way vs HU. I always thought in the reverse.. Espically in 1-2/1-3. Multi way pots are generally spots I fast play my sets.. Mind you, I RARELY slow play sets.. this was just a special case do to villian tendencies.

    Caj
    So lets say the board is very dry but maybe a low gutshot is possible. thats not very likely to hit many players..but they might peel lighter..like with middle pairs etc.. I dont necessarily want to fast play this board because all those fairly weak one pair hands would fold if I did play the hand faster.. So I end up making more money and sometimes alot more if say someone with a pair turns two pair etc...

    Now heads up villain either has a hand big enough to call or not.. Now when he bets so big i think he either is betting as a "one and done" bet where you dont make anything more.. or his hand is strong. If his hand is strong you should fast play. if his hand is a one and done you wont make anymore anyways..

    ww
  • MrFizzbinMrFizzbin Posts: 356Subscriber
    Lead river w. about 1/2 pot....
  • daniel9861 Posts: 207Subscriber
    edited April 2015
    I think check/call flop is good since this is a good multi barrelling board for his air which should make up most of his range in a BTN vs blind battle.

    On this particular turn however I don't think his air is going to double barrel all that often since your Ax hands and pairs are probably calling again and some of his Ax hands are checking back. Therefore I think leading turn is best.

    On the river check/raise is good since his air will bet and it's doubtful he has 4x after the turn check back. Also depending on his tendencies it seems like a decent spot for hero to turn a hand into a bluff like 66 or 77 since V's range is mostly capped to Ax.
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