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Looking for some feedback on a hand I played.

Hey all I just want to know if this was a bad way to play my hand. I was in MP this is a 1/2 game. First to act opened for 15 he got one caller in front of me i called with pocket jacks. The button called as well. The flop came 9d Jd 2s checks to me I checked hoping the button would bet. He was pretty loose. This time he checked too turn came 5d. Checked to me again I checked as well button bet 30 all folded I called. River came 3c I check the button bet 45. What do i do here?

Comments

  • dpbuckdpbuck Posts: 2,009Subscriber
    Depending on reads of opener, a raise might be viable, but your flat can be okay too. Your mistake was checking the flop. Definitely bet. With straight draws and flush draws possible, there are a ton of hands to get value from. Since you didn't bet the flop, bet the turn for the same reasons. As played, call the river. Your hand is extremely underrepped. Villain could play TT and 9x like this, in addition to a made flush.
  • boredoo Posts: 223Subscriber
    edited April 2015
    Mandatory flop bet for value. Flush draws will often call. By checking you let all draws get a free shot at your stack, and there are quite a few flush and straight draws that people could have. Same goes for the turn. Now there are three diamonds and if it checks through any diamond beats your hand if a 4th comes in. Bet for more value and to charge draws.

    As played you have to call river because of how under repped your hand is. That's another benefit of betting (derivative to the more important aspect of getting value and making others make mistakes by calling): if you bet two streets, he calls, and he leads out river you should seriously consider folding as he usually has a flush.
  • YoungGrinder Posts: 210Subscriber
    As others have stated, just lead out on the flop for near the pot. At 1/2 especially (as Bart says and most of us can attest), 95% of the money made comes for value betting. If you donk out, flush draws, middling pairs, case Js, and straight draws will call as well. Then you could continue to lead the turn and set up for a river shove if called on the turn. Obviously with the flush coming in, it is a bit read-dependent.

    As played, on the river I would just call as people don't value bet thinly enough at 1/2 so I would say that at least 35-50% of his range is flushes here. If we try to raise for thin value, some of the two pairs may fold out which won't allow us to be good more than 50% of the time when we raise.
  • ThehammahThehammah Posts: 7,086Subscriber
    So think of it this way. The more draws possible the more $$$ you can make.

    Poker is a game of value not trapping. So all things beings equal betting is better

    You played this hand backwards and will most likely make less. This is assuming you didnt have a specific read that button would bet as bluff or drawing

    You need to plan out the hand ie think about what line based on players etc. i do that as i enter pot

    Like i say to myself "i will lead into this player". Or " the guy playing behind me is maniac so if i check he might ship it".

    If you cant come up with this plan then work on your standard lines against avg unknowns. Checking hoping someone else bets is fish play and you need to stop that like NOW.

    :wink:
  • StACkOffStACkOff Posts: 71Member
    Smitty219 said:
    The flop came 9d Jd 2s checks to me I checked hoping the button would bet. He was pretty loose.
    A loose vilain doesn't mean he is agressif.
    The flat PF is fine to me, depending the OR I might 3bet or just call PF. FLOP I rather lead out arround 40 for value.
    Here's why, in this configuration you got a set of Jacks, so not a ton of value that BU can have, few combo of JX, 99 22. He is not betting below I think.

    Another thing, Is a vilain in position will have a high bluffing frequency in a 4way pot against a vilain showing strentgh in early position and a flop hitting the PF calling range of the other vilain? I think his bluffing frequency in this spot will be low. He might consider a stab with a combo FD but there is not a ton of combo (hands like AXd KTd+ QTd T8d T7d). Otherwise he will ckb most of his range of weak/medium draw, and weak value 2nd pair and below.

    Given that, his betting frequency will not be very high so I prefer lead out. And in general, the more player are in position on me the more I like to check because, there will be more chance for somebody betting in position. Here you are 3rd to act on 4 peoples. One more think I like is betting to get ride of the vilain in position on me to steal position for the next street. Since vilain BU have two players behind, his range will be more solide and wont try anything fancy.
  • StACkOffStACkOff Posts: 71Member
    As played I cc turn and cc or cf depending on vilain.
    The vilain you are describing here seem to be very passif here, and his bet river looks value oriented. I dont see him betting less than a flush or a set of 5 (3combo).
    I might find a fold here, you dont beat much.
  • Smitty219 Posts: 9Subscriber
    Wow thanks for all the great feedback. I admit I was being tricky here. I would usually just come right out betting. I called the guy showed a flush so there goes that.
  • Arenzano Posts: 1,399Subscriber
    i see you posted the results, but the river is rarely a call as he is never betting 9x or any pair for value.
  • Smitty219 Posts: 9Subscriber
    This is a insta fold here you think? I'm a lost worst than I thought I was. :(
    Arenzano said:
    i see you posted the results, but the river is rarely a call as he is never betting 9x or any pair for value.
  • Arenzano Posts: 1,399Subscriber
    Smitty219 said:
    This is a insta fold here you think? I'm a lost worst than I thought I was. :(
    Arenzano said:
    i see you posted the results, but the river is rarely a call as he is never betting 9x or any pair for value.
    The villain is betting 30 into 60 when the flush turns, then bets 45 into 120 after you check the river. If he had a 9 or TT, do you think he bets turn and river? He can take the showdown with 9x or TT. Even though you played the hand pretty passively, if he was the type to bluff, wouldn't he bet more?
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