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slow play flop or raise?

350Effective with Villian
2 limps and hero over limps (44black)button raises to 25 and we go 4ways to the flop
Field caller donks 45 HERO in the middle ? Thoughts?

Comments

  • dpbuckdpbuck Posts: 2,009Subscriber
    What is the board? Reads on button? Donker? Your post doesn't have near enough information to offer anything.

    Also, limp/calling 44 against a 70 BB stack is probably a leak.

  • StarwarsJediMasterStarwarsJediMaster Posts: 741Subscriber
    dpbuck said:
    What is the board? Reads on button? Donker? Your post doesn't have near enough information to offer anything.

    Also, limp/calling 44 against a 70 BB stack is probably a leak.

    Sorry the raiser was otb and was 700effective, but 350effective with the field donker, his donkin range is tp and draws from playing alot with Villian.
  • dpbuckdpbuck Posts: 2,009Subscriber
    And the flop was?
  • ANason21ANason21 Posts: 166Subscriber
    edited July 2015
    dpbuck said:
    What is the board? Reads on button? Donker? Your post doesn't have near enough information to offer anything.

    Also, limp/calling 44 against a 70 BB stack is probably a leak.

    I agree that we need more info here--like the board. I disagree that limp calling a 70 BB stack is a leak. We limp for 5 and face a raise to 25, stacks only have to be 20*15=300 deep (not even, considering the money already in the pot) to profitably set mine. Once you consider that smaller stacks are more likely to stack off with hands worse than sets, I think it's an easy call after limping even if the pre-flop raiser only has a 70 BB stack.

    Now, assuming you hit your set, my response to your question totally dependent on your read of both Villains and the board texture. How wet is the board? Are there high cards? Are there lots of cards that could kill your action on the turn or river if you play slow? Is the pre-flop raiser likely to give up facing a weak donk lead and a flat call if he doesn't hit his hand? Or might he bump it to $175 because of the perceived weakness? Is the donk-leader the type that will stack off now with his draws or top pair and about 60 BB remaining in his stack but would fold to a bet on the turn if he doesn't hit?

    In a vacuum, I lean towards putting in a small raise, say to like $100 or 105. You don't want to blast the donk leader out of the pot, and it's not going to be difficult to get stacks in by the river even with a call-call-call line. But it's a total disaster if you flat, pre-flop raiser folds, and then a card comes that scares donk-leader into shutting down.

  • StarwarsJediMasterStarwarsJediMaster Posts: 741Subscriber
    ANason21 said:
    dpbuck said:
    What is the board? Reads on button? Donker? Your post doesn't have near enough information to offer anything.

    Also, limp/calling 44 against a 70 BB stack is probably a leak.

    I agree that we need more info here--like the board. I disagree that limp calling a 70 BB stack is a leak. We limp for 5 and face a raise to 25, stacks only have to be 20*15=300 deep (not even, considering the money already in the pot) to profitably set mine. Once you consider that smaller stacks are more likely to stack off with hands worse than sets, I think it's an easy call after limping even if the pre-flop raiser only has a 70 BB stack.

    Now, assuming you hit your set, my response to your question totally dependent on your read of both Villains and the board texture. How wet is the board? Are there high cards? Are there lots of cards that could kill your action on the turn or river if you play slow? Is the pre-flop raiser likely to give up facing a weak donk lead and a flat call if he doesn't hit his hand? Or might he bump it to $175 because of the perceived weakness? Is the donk-leader the type that will stack off now with his draws or top pair and about 60 BB remaining in his stack but would fold to a bet on the turn if he doesn't hit?

    In a vacuum, I lean towards putting in a small raise, say to like $100 or 105. You don't want to blast the donk leader out of the pot, and it's not going to be difficult to get stacks in by the river even with a call-call-call line. But it's a total disaster if you flat, pre-flop raiser folds, and then a card comes that scares donk-leader into shutting down.

    The pre flop raiser was on the button and was 700 effective with me, but the main villain in the hand who was the field caller is 300 effective with me.
  • StarwarsJediMasterStarwarsJediMaster Posts: 741Subscriber
    StarwarsJediMaster said:
    ANason21 said:
    dpbuck said:
    What is the board? Reads on button? Donker? Your post doesn't have near enough information to offer anything.

    Also, limp/calling 44 against a 70 BB stack is probably a leak.

    I agree that we need more info here--like the board. I disagree that limp calling a 70 BB stack is a leak. We limp for 5 and face a raise to 25, stacks only have to be 20*15=300 deep (not even, considering the money already in the pot) to profitably set mine. Once you consider that smaller stacks are more likely to stack off with hands worse than sets, I think it's an easy call after limping even if the pre-flop raiser only has a 70 BB stack.

    Now, assuming you hit your set, my response to your question totally dependent on your read of both Villains and the board texture. How wet is the board? Are there high cards? Are there lots of cards that could kill your action on the turn or river if you play slow? Is the pre-flop raiser likely to give up facing a weak donk lead and a flat call if he doesn't hit his hand? Or might he bump it to $175 because of the perceived weakness? Is the donk-leader the type that will stack off now with his draws or top pair and about 60 BB remaining in his stack but would fold to a bet on the turn if he doesn't hit?

    In a vacuum, I lean towards putting in a small raise, say to like $100 or 105. You don't want to blast the donk leader out of the pot, and it's not going to be difficult to get stacks in by the river even with a call-call-call line. But it's a total disaster if you flat, pre-flop raiser folds, and then a card comes that scares donk-leader into shutting down.

    The pre flop raiser was on the button and was 700 effective with me, but the main villain in the hand who was the field caller is 300 effective with me.
    I think your right on the flop that I should be making a small raise, I am losing value from the donk bettor and the pre flop raiser was a fish that would never fold a tp+ to a weak donk lead and a min-ish small raise on the flop

  • beauregard Posts: 1,592Subscriber
    you realize that you haven't given a flop board.

    so it's hard to offer advice as what you should do with 4 4
    when the board looks like this:

    X× X× X×
  • High__Rolla Posts: 775Subscriber
    beauregard said:
    you realize that you haven't given a flop board.

    so it's hard to offer advice as what you should do with 4 4
    when the board looks like this:

    X× X× X×
    Hero obviously flopped quads - see the thread title. Slowplay is standard.

  • chilidog Posts: 2,427Subscriber
    edited July 2015
    There sure are a lot of posts in this thread for a hand without any details. I know poker is a game of incomplete information, but c'mon man.
  • StarwarsJediMasterStarwarsJediMaster Posts: 741Subscriber
    Lol sorry flop T 6 4 r
  • hectorjelly Posts: 47Subscriber
    edited July 2015
    I'd raise. Any non pairing card from a 2 to a 9 makes a possible straight and there are four overcards will also scare a ten
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