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equity protection/value bet idk?

StarwarsJediMasterStarwarsJediMaster Posts: 741Subscriber
edited July 2015 in NLHE Strategy Discussion
2/5Nl 500 cap
Hero winning image, table is loose passive leaning towards the tighter side.
About 650 effective , hero opens(TT) utg 25 get 5 callers from behind and both blinds fold
Flop(150) J 9 4 r
Hero? Thoughts?

Comments

  • dpbuckdpbuck Posts: 2,004Subscriber
    Your hand?
  • chilidog Posts: 2,427Subscriber
    My thought is that you should proof read your posts before you click on Post Thread.
    by 1dpbuck
  • StarwarsJediMasterStarwarsJediMaster Posts: 741Subscriber
    dpbuck said:
    Your hand?
    Sorry lol (TT)

  • dpbuckdpbuck Posts: 2,004Subscriber
    OOP 6 ways I'm probably check/evaluating.
  • FuzzyDunlop Posts: 139Subscriber
    Against 5 callers, there's no way you can cbet OOP. You can possibly check call if everyone checks and someone in late position bets.
  • StarwarsJediMasterStarwarsJediMaster Posts: 741Subscriber
    FuzzyDunlop said:
    Against 5 callers, there's no way you can cbet OOP. You can possibly check call if everyone checks and someone in late position bets.
    say instead I had JTs that I opened from utg, I would probably c bet that flop mainly for equity protection isn't TT basically the same hand value , so why not c bet for equity protection or is there just to many players and someone is more likely to have a J. I just don't think there is many Jx hands in cold calling ranges, I think its much different if the flop was Kxx, or Axx because theres more Kxs, Kx, Axs, Ax hands in cold calling ranges. idk if this flawed logic.
  • dpbuckdpbuck Posts: 2,004Subscriber
    If you have JT, there are 33% fewer jacks available in villain ranges.
  • StarwarsJediMasterStarwarsJediMaster Posts: 741Subscriber
    dpbuck said:
    If you have JT, there are 33% fewer jacks available in villain ranges.
    ya your right but in a vacuum there are less Jx hands in cold calling ranges from weak loose rec players than Kx and Ax, would you agree ? do you think going for a min C/R on that 9 turn is optimistic ? a 8 or lower turn I think is a great line ,but unsure if a 9 is a great card to go for a C/R cause It will get checked though at a high frequency. At the same time I think with the board being so draw heavy that villain will make a showdown bet with a Ax hand. what do you think ?

  • dpbuckdpbuck Posts: 2,004Subscriber
    As more players come along, calling ranges get wider and wider. Yes, there are more Ax than Jx in ranges, but any Jx where x>7 is possibly/probably calling by the end.
  • FuzzyDunlop Posts: 139Subscriber
    StarwarsJediMaster said:
    say instead I had JTs that I opened from utg, I would probably c bet that flop mainly for equity protection isn't TT basically the same hand value , so why not c bet for equity protection or is there just to many players and someone is more likely to have a J. I just don't think there is many Jx hands in cold calling ranges, I think its much different if the flop was Kxx, or Axx because theres more Kxs, Kx, Axs, Ax hands in cold calling ranges. idk if this flawed logic.
    I agree with dpbuck on this. If someone doesn't have a jack there you're lucky. If the flop checks through and a low disconnected cards comes then you could consider a delayed cbet for the same reasons you were wanting to be the flop.

    When you raise TT UTG and get five callers, it may as well be 55 - mentally give up on it unless you get a great flop. In this case you got an OK flop that give you some hope - but not enough to blindly put more money into the pot until you have seen what action follows you.

  • snapper35 Posts: 243Subscriber
    Table change? This table dynamic of limpy/passive/multiway is all or nothing.

    If you run good then you win 3-5k in 2 hours.

    Mostly tho a few raises PF then b/f or c/f on the flop.
    Or you get small prs/Axs to over flush and miss. End up with a short stack.
    One 3 bet pre to win 25 or steal a small pot with good board texture ipos.
    But then these pots dont off set your misses and you are the short stack in 2 orbits.

    Nobody came to fold top pr right?
    You block straight draws so target range is Jx, a peel from KQs, or value from a 9.
    Check(raise)-evaluate. V bets from EP/LP position, bet sizing and field callers?
    A bet of more than 1/2 pot only Jx calls or KQs

    FP bet 35-50?!?!?! That keeps in a 9, KQs and the Jx? But on the
    Trn V's ranges are capped from your small bet size on flop now do whatever







  • DrGambol Posts: 724Subscriber
    Assuming you're not playing anyone that would exploit this, I'd Cbet tiny (like 1/3-1/4 pot) to get overcards to fold and get looked up by worse. I will emphasize again though that you only want to do this against people who will not exploit this. If people are going to raise you off your thin value bets knowing how weak you are, then you're taking the worst line possible by b/f and sizing it to induce their bluff.
  • Bandgeek Posts: 140Subscriber
    What dpbuck said.

    The first V "cold called", the next 4 came along with great pot odds. There's a shit ton of J8-JK in those ranges.

    If you're on a heater and have a god like image you can cbet here because they'll make you for an overpair, but otherwise its a c/f on flop for me.
  • laphonso Posts: 70Subscriber
    6 way flop? Ck and fold
  • laphonso Posts: 70Subscriber
    I would probably ck and fold j10 also in this spot, after I folded it pre
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