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What do I do here

jl815 Posts: 3Subscriber
edited November -1 in NLHE Strategy Discussion
History on Villain - I played with him for 2 hours up until now seen him
in some action but normally he would fold on flop or turn unless he had
something. I seen him show down 3 hands one was 8's full of 9's, an
Ace high flush (to beat a King flush) and a Nut srt8.
In the last 30 minutes he was opening alot of pots for $7

To start this hand I have $171 at a $1 -$2NL game.

I hold KhJs in SB

(villain) UTG raises $7

3 callers I complete


(villain) bets 20 3 callers

I raise to $61 (my thoughts were that maybe UTG had AQ
with Ah or Qh I wanted to eliminate str8 draws and low flush draws
and I thought top pair with Kh kicker was best hand at this time)

(villan) calls and everyone else folds.

(to me this action of just calling seemed super strong like he had
QQ, AA, or TTT.)


I have $100 left pot is $184 villain has me covered.
What do I do here?? chk-fold, Bet, or chk-call?


  • kessma Posts: 12Member
    not critizing but you need to have a plan for when he calls and consider what the the remaining stacks are OTT and what your plan is for when he calls if you raise OTF. I only like your flop raise if he has alot of draws in his range but then you raise too small and give him the right odds to continue with almost his entire UTG open range. AA and QQ probably get it in on the flop, most likely TTT too. You maneuvered yourself into quite a sticky spot where all options are bad but I would shove because he has draws in his range and you might be able to fold out AJ&AT. Check-call is horrible..
  • jl815 Posts: 3Subscriber
    Thank You I agree this really bad because I only had a plan IF another heart fell. somehow I was too blinded at the time to realize he would shove on flop with AA and TTT, but now that you say that I agree.
  • bobo1384 Posts: 145Subscriber
    Why are we check/raising the flop?

    As played I think I am going all-in with the $100
    I think villain can have QQ+,AJ, QJ,KQ, AhTx, AQhh. QQ+ might have just flatted the flop raise because the check/raise looks really strong. I don't think villain is going to bet any of his range that we beat if we check to him. I think if we go all in villain calls with all of his draws and if he is really tight and weak you might get better to fold because your line looks so strong when you check/raise flop.

    I think I would have just flatted the flop if it was me with the intention of check/calling safe turns and probably check/folding river if draws come in or original raiser bets river and another spot calls. I hate playing this hand multiway out of position but Im not folding here either although some say I probably should.
  • Dak Posts: 31SubscriberProfessional
    Couple of problems. I think your #1 mistake was calling in the blind with kj off to a ug raiser. On top of that the vilian has only shown down nut hands & appears to be on a heater.. I would have a very small range of calling preflop in sb vs a ug raiser who appears to be nitty & kj off would/should never be in that range. #2 problem your shortstacked . This should also be narrowing your calling range preflop from sb. As played- I would ch/call flop . If he bets turn , I'm folding. You said in the post he plays abc postflop.. But again- you should have never be in this spot preflop.
  • JCW Posts: 591Subscriber
    Preflop. Fold or raise. Villain only goes to showdown with nutty hands so 3b will get a lot of his pre-flop to fold. You have a couple of blockers. Overall, rather fold but an occasional 3b is good too. Fold to all 4b. Then take note that you folded to 4b and you have shown that you can 3b light.

    Flop. Poor spot to check raise. If you do call, he most likely only has 1 bullet on this board. If he fires again, you know he is more likely strong. Keeping the draws calling gives you some dead money and leverage against his bet. If you call and +1 calls. His turn action will be even more honest. if it goes ck/ck/ck you have a hand to value bet river (not always good but good enough for some value). You can also fold when the draws hit.

    Again, better to fold pre-flop and not be oop with this hand. As you see you flopped top pair and don't like where you are. However, against a lot of players it is fine to call pre and flop if you can take it away on river when you miss.

    After he calls your check raise, his range is stronger than yours. You still have the best hand here once in a while (my guess 20-30%) but overall you are in trouble to hands like QQ, AJ type hands. Check turn and evaluate with leans towards folds.

    Those are my thoughts.
  • TDF Posts: 1,130Subscriber
    I like flop c/r on this board cause you can represent a lot of draws. Just ship any turn if called. If raised OTF I would tank and put together best estimation of the raiser range to see how much equity I have and than act accordingly. You need to practice doing it a lot when off the table to be able to do it in real time.
    Preflop you have all options available. What to do would depend on skills differential between you and other players involved and also on game dynamics prior to this hand. Like if UTG was opening wide I would be inclined to 3bet.
  • PokerIsFrustrating Posts: 657Member
    As people said PF is usually a fold or sometimes a squeeze raise. Your hand plays poorly multiway and you're OOP so if you flop the hand you flop you have problems.

    The problem you have is if the PFR has a hand that beats yours (which is a lot, AA-TT, AJ, JT) and other players are drawing (you're probably up against at least a flush draw and possibly straight + flush draws) you're kind of screwed. What you have going for you is usually people will raise any 2pair+ hand on this board because it's so wet. So the 3 callers probably don't have JT or sets, although you'll see guys with hands like AJ just call. Will they ever lay down AJ if you raise? Not sure.

    I'm really not sure why we think PFR never has anything when he cbets into 4 people on a super drawy board and he's only shown down nut hands. Not sure why we'd read him as having AQo here. I dont' even think AQo bets.

    Moral of the story here is if you make a raise FOR VALUE where, when called, we think the action of just calling is so strong we have to be beat - we've made a mistake.
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