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Weird preflop call by Pro so I ask Pros why.

FuzzypupFuzzypup Posts: 2,298Subscriber
edited April 2016 in NLHE Strategy Discussion
Had this interesting hand that I played vs a recognized young pro recently. Pro is always on the phone at the table playing something. People know me at my casino and I am seen as a tough opponent.

I can only think this pro didn't know me for some reason. But I have played with him a few sessions.

so.... I stole from the CO and he called my raise with suited trash from the SB. I decided to play my hand in a different way post flop to get value from him. The hand went to SD. So that's how I know what he had.

But what I don't understand is why he did it, especially from the SB where you get less value for your money. Clearly I am not a fish and my base image is tight. I am not perceived as a folder. Is he that overconfident that he thinks he can out play me OOP with suited trash?

I ask the pros.
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Comments

  • ACK Posts: 428Subscriber
    He called because he has leaks in his game.
  • ACK Posts: 428Subscriber
    I see winning players call 4x raises from the blinds with A5o and 85s very often.
  • sxz18 Posts: 345Member
    I like calling from the blinds with speculative hands against specific types of opponents. Is it a leak? Many assume so but it works for me.

    I believe his reasoning is something along the lines of you're tight and not making folds so he can get paid if he connects.
  • FuzzypupFuzzypup Posts: 2,298Subscriber
    edited April 2016
    This guy is in magazines. He is always on the phone playing some game at the table. My partner and I came to the same conclusions about the weak points in his game independently. I'm not saying I am some super player. I really don't want to face Ed Miller or Bart at the table. I prefer my tables full of fish. But I do have the discipline that I think all players should have at this game. I rarely see it. So it is actually very surprising to see a player who has won hundreds of thousands of dollars lack it.

    I just read an article by Bart in Card Player that I have said the same thing for years.

    Pick the 2nd largest game at the casino... The largest game always has the regs. And it is 100% the case at my casino. They all play each other and I can't phathom why. the lower stake game is far FAR juicier, you can win the same amount per hour, and have far less risk.

    If by chance anyone here is at my casino and knows who I am plz don't mention the pro's name in this post.
  • scarygary Posts: 88Subscriber
    Sounds like a shitty pro if he's on his phone that much.

    What was your raise size pre flop?

    Specifically what suited trash hand are we talking about?


  • scarygary Posts: 88Subscriber
    And what's your RFI look like in the CO?
  • stayinschool Posts: 2,969Subscriber
    People just good this stuff all the time. I went though that phase where I did a ton of stupid shit with SC and stuff. He's probably been watching some pro play so he thinks he can do that also.
  • DrSpace Posts: 716Subscriber
    Most pros are terrible with many leaks. Few last more than a couple of years. Many make garbage money.
  • FuzzypupFuzzypup Posts: 2,298Subscriber
    Think of a hand like Q2s.

    I'm balanced preflop adjusting for the drop, my hand, who is in the blinds, who is behind me, etc. My partner and I have seen him make several mistakes he did independently that to us his play was clearly not correct vs the specific opponent. He plays there more than I do. This player has won many MTTs for large amounts of money both live and online. Ive read some of his articles and the guy knows his math and understands poker very well.

    I watch the high stakes game. I am 100% competent to play it but I'm like why bother? I will make the same amount of money at my stakes. It's loaded with regs. I see all sorts of sizing mistakes, hand reading mistakes, frustration tells.

    Maybe I am too anal.

    I will say this about CLP forums. I think here is the best conversation about poker that I have seen on any forum. Even when I disagree with the post the points made are very good and make me think. I only post and read here because I think the caliber of players are higher than the other sites.

    I personally find Bart's and Ed Miller's articles in Card Player informative and verifying of information I already know. Frankly I am surprised players are not better than they are. Some of these articles are gold. The best ones I rip out of the magazine and save to review each year as a reminder.
  • EvilEcstasy Posts: 44Member
    edited April 2016
    Fuzzypup said:
    This guy is in magazines. He is always on the phone playing some game at the table. My partner and I came to the same conclusions about the weak points in his game independently. I'm not saying I am some super player. I really don't want to face Ed Miller or Bart at the table. I prefer my tables full of fish. But I do have the discipline that I think all players should have at this game. I rarely see it. So it is actually very surprising to see a player who has won hundreds of thousands of dollars lack it.

    I just read an article by Bart in Card Player that I have said the same thing for years.

    Pick the 2nd largest game at the casino... The largest game always has the regs. And it is 100% the case at my casino. They all play each other and I can't phathom why. the lower stake game is far FAR juicier, you can win the same amount per hour, and have far less risk.

    If by chance anyone here is at my casino and knows who I am plz don't mention the pro's name in this post.
    Sometimes the regs all suck in the biggest game. So that's why you should play it. In fact I've never encountered a 10/25 or smaller game with multiple good regs in it. If youre talking about 50/1 at the bellagio I can understand tho
  • iamallin Posts: 1,173SubscriberProfessional
    Here are some reasons I will offer.

    1. He was bored and looking to gamble.
    2. He was tiled and looking to gamble.
    3. Stacks were very deep and he thinks he has room to bluff post flop or get paid when he binks something. May be the BB is a huge whale and he just wants to play any hand with the BB.
    4. He just thinks you are all bad players and he can outplay you.

    1 2 and 4 are clearly mistakes that most pros running hot will make.

    The only legitimate reason to play suited trash from blinds with a flat call is number 3 imo.

  • FuzzypupFuzzypup Posts: 2,298Subscriber
    Guess I'm different at the table. I'm all business.
  • FreeLunch Posts: 1,308Pro
    edited April 2016
    Unless he was advertising or trying to change the game up (which does not ring true if he is phone glued) then he is probably just on mini tilt or is not as good as you/he thinks.
  • FuzzypupFuzzypup Posts: 2,298Subscriber
    Then he mini-tilts a lot lol.
  • scarygary Posts: 88Subscriber
    He's probably just a shitty reg who god ran and won a tournament. Reality will catch up with him eventually.
  • stayinschool Posts: 2,969Subscriber
    Like what was the exact hand?
  • FuzzypupFuzzypup Posts: 2,298Subscriber
    It was his preflop call that was odd. He played the hand fine post flop.
  • marseille Posts: 400Subscriber
    IDK, maybe he treats poker as-gasp- a game?
    Lighten up at the table is my advice. Judging others' leaks and measuring yourself against other players is just preening imo. And I say this having done the same thing for quite a while.
  • marseille Posts: 400Subscriber
    edited April 2016
    Also: just because he's a pro doesn't mean he doesn't suck at his job. Look around your own workplace...
  • FuzzypupFuzzypup Posts: 2,298Subscriber
    Not judging, just questioning why. Some secret skill I don't know of. I still don't want to play the guy and I move tables if he is on my left. I can certainly understand a fat ego entering the game and thinking they can outplay anyone.

    I do really well at poker but I also table select like a pro lol. No tough tables.

    I think the above comments by most hit the mark. He over estimates his abilities because the field is so bad and isn't paying attention to my play while looking at his phone 90% of the time.
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