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$5/$10 Play a hand against me (Podcast 4/26/16)

BartBart Posts: 5,725AdministratorLeadPro
edited April 2016 in NLHE Strategy Discussion
Hero in the game is a big winner in the game. Sits with $1700. Image is neutral to slightly losing.

$5/10 Commerce 1am Sunday morning. Bart Hanson just table changed to the table.

UTG bad, Armenian rec player limps UTG ($800). Bart ($1500) makes it $40, UTG1. UTG2 calls, Hero has 4 5 in CO and calls. Button calls, BB calls, limper calls. Pot is 6 ways to the flop.

$240 FLOP: A T 3

Check, check Villain bets $145. Fold, Hero calls. Only limper calls.

$675: TURN: 2 Check, Hanson bets $420. Hero decides to call as pot is bloated and Hero doesnt want Hanson to make a hero fold. Also wants the possibility of the limper coming along. Limper moves all-in for $620 total (action is not reopened). Hanson calls. Hero calls.

$2535: A

Hanson quickly moves all-in for $700 into dry side pot. Hero?
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Comments

  • ThehammahThehammah Posts: 7,083SubscriberProfessional
    edited April 2016
    how can heros image be neutral to slightly losing and be a big winner in the game with $1700.

    you also list two players as utg you and armenian

    hero is CO since only btn called in pos?
  • BartBart Posts: 5,725AdministratorLeadPro
    Thehammah said:
    how can heros image be neutral to slightly losing and be a big winner in the game with $1700.

    you also list two players as utg you and armenian

    hero is CO since only btn called in pos?
    Hero is in CO, yes. I didnt list two players UTG. And Hero is big winner in the player pool (overall).
  • stayinschool Posts: 2,969Subscriber
    edited April 2016
    Sooooo gross I don't even want to try and think of the right response but here goes.

    I think just calling flop and turn is by far best.

    Worried about AT, TT, AA. 15 combos total. Maybe more like 10-12 after card removal from limper. IDK I just don't think we can call despite the price. I mean you have done some sick stuff in the past in terms of going for weird thin value and stuff but I dont know. I mean i'm just not sure if you bet AK OTR for value. What can you get called by from a good player. It is insanely gross but I lean towards folding.

    Can't be certain but I imagine I would call this in game more than I would fold even though I think folding is best.
  • ThehammahThehammah Posts: 7,083SubscriberProfessional
    this is similar to my hand last week when villain was all in and two others in the pot

    bart cant be bluffing here and he also has I think flushes in his range like kqcc or qjcc all of which turned flush draws on turn

    I think this is a fold

    ww
  • stayinschool Posts: 2,969Subscriber
    Thehammah said:
    this is similar to my hand last week when villain was all in and two others in the pot

    bart cant be bluffing here and he also has I think flushes in his range like kqcc or qjcc all of which turned flush draws on turn

    I think this is a fold

    ww
    I agree this is a fold but I don't think bart has flushes. Do you really think he is betting into so many people on the flop with just a GS and BDFD?
  • ThehammahThehammah Posts: 7,083SubscriberProfessional
    good point. but that makes barts hand even stronger. like hes saying he can beat flushes.
  • stayinschool Posts: 2,969Subscriber
    Thehammah said:
    good point. but that makes barts hand even stronger. like hes saying he can beat flushes.
    Yea, I don't think we have a ton of flushes either but I agree. I think it would probably we a fold even with the flush missing tho
  • squishmytomatosquishmytomato Posts: 348SubscriberProfessional
    do we think Bart shoves for thin value with AK here?

    if we give him 1/2 the combos of AK (4) and we give him TT (3), AA (1), AT (6) and maybe one KQcc, we are about 27% against this range.

    with only two combos of Ak we are only 15%.

    at first I thought this was an instant fold, but we need to be good onlyabout 18% of the time to make this call. I think it's closer than I thought if Bart is shoving Ak some of the time here.
  • stayinschool Posts: 2,969Subscriber
    squishmytomato said:
    do we think Bart shoves for thin value with AK here?

    if we give him 1/2 the combos of AK (4) and we give him TT (3), AA (1), AT (6) and maybe one KQcc, we are about 27% against this range.

    with only two combos of Ak we are only 15%.

    at first I thought this was an instant fold, but we need to be good onlyabout 18% of the time to make this call. I think it's closer than I thought if Bart is shoving Ak some of the time here.
    Why would bart ever shove river with AK tho?
  • iamallin Posts: 1,173SubscriberProfessional
    edited April 2016
    The only way Hero wins is if both the Armenian guy and Bart have trip aces.

    Even for a really bad player, it is very unlikely to assume that he is shoving turn with just an ace. I mean that is just too bad. He has to have Aces up/Set/Pair + FD on turn to shove with no fold equity.

    IF that is not enough, we have to wonder why Bart is shoving with trip aces -most likely of which is AK. To get called by Hero's Ax? But if Hero has trip A, what does the Armenian guy have? It is very ambitious of Bart to think that AK is ahead of both the hero and the Armenian guy AND can get called by hero.

    I mean who I am kidding. AQ/AJ is such a snap fold in this spot for Hero.

    Given that Bart knows this, and given that the pot is protected making it less likely Bart is bluffing. I think Hero can find a disciplined fold here.
  • maphacks Posts: 1,985Subscriber
    edited April 2016
    snapcall!

    Bart Hanson has many AK,AQ and some AJ in his range and having 700 left when the pot is 2535 there is no other play than to go allin for hanson since check/folding is too tight with given odds and check/calling is a negative freeroll.

  • ridethevariance Posts: 42Subscriber
    What should Bart do if he knows that he loses to hero but beats the limper? Also if we know hero is good and can make hero folds, what should Bart do with his hand?
    stayinschool said:


    Why would bart ever shove river with AK tho?
  • the_dude_abides Posts: 325Subscriber
    Bart is only leading a strong hand on this flop into 5 players. Can we even give him AQ here?

    Limper has an A pretty often which further reduces Ax combos for Bart and would only leave one AA combo for Bart.

    Bet of 420 on the turn is larger relative to the pot than the flop bet. Maybe this is due to the BD flush equity other players possibly picked up. Also, and probably a bigger part of the bet sizing, Bart could be going for max value vs an ace and feels more comfortable doing so now that the flop had multiple callers.

    On the river, if Bart has, say AK, and the limper has the case A, the river shove is never getting called by worse. On top of that he is betting into a dry side pot and there is no reason for him to bluff unless he thinks that he has limper beat and that hero will fold a better hand. The only bluffing hand I see here is specifically AK with the K of clubs.

    I just think this is 1010 a lot. I say fold.
  • stayinschool Posts: 2,969Subscriber
    How would bart know he looses to hero with AK on this board??? It he putting us on this incredibly hidden straight? And If bart has AK it is a very small range of hands, if any, that he thinks he can get hero to fold that have him beat.

    Say the limper is very bad and can have like any A and maybe some FD's and GSs. Then I think this play by bart is a little better because he can do it with AJ+ knowing that he is ahead of the limper a lot. However, we have no read that the limper is that bad so I don't think this scenario is possible.
  • Rocketman74Rocketman74 Posts: 451Subscriber
    Given Bart's line I fold (and die a little inside when he shows down AK)
  • ZambrotAZambrotA Posts: 372Subscriber
    Pot now being $3235, $700 to call, getting over 4,5-1 i would never fold against BH and by the way, the only folds i see here with those odds are against The Nits who would never ever bet here without full house.
    I believe BH has at least AJ here.
  • beauregard Posts: 1,592Subscriber
    interesting hand...
    Bart said:
    $5/10 Commerce 1am Sunday morning. Bart Hanson just table changed to the table.

    UTG bad, Armenian rec player limps UTG ($800). Bart ($1500) makes it $40, UTG1. UTG2 calls, Hero has 4 5 and calls. Button calls, BB calls, limper calls. Pot is 6 ways to the flop.

    $240 FLOP: A T 3

    Check, check Villain bets $145. Fold, Hero calls. Only limper calls.
    Flop action - is Bart = Villain?
    Or one of the "check" players?
  • BartBart Posts: 5,725AdministratorLeadPro
    edited April 2016
    Villain is me Beau in UTG +1

    Preflop is UTG limps, I raise UTG1 , UTG2 calls, Hero calls CO, button calls, BB calls Just like my OP.

    Flop is BB checks limper checks, Bart bets, also in the OP.
    .
  • beauregard Posts: 1,592Subscriber
    Dang! tough hand....

    So Bart - aka Villain - is the aggressor on all streets....

    If Hero is a good winning player - then he knows Bart knows this - and Bart would not be as spewy vs him.

    I think Bart can have wide range that included A3, A2, AT, 33, TT - and other combos like 4 5, J T and other T X hands..... all that get there by the river.

    The only hands that Hero makes money - are ties against 4 5 and 4 5

    I don't see what Bart would be shoving for value that we beat. And with there being a dry side pot - I don't see why Bart would shove unless it is for value.

    Against other players - I think the "quickly moves all in" shows that the aggressor is bluffing. But against Hero - a good player - I think it's more a leveling war and Bart is trying to appear weak.

    I can't find a call here. Good play, Bart.
  • dontfeedthenits Posts: 396Subscriber
    edited April 2016
    I'm including AK in Bart's range and call getting ~ 4.5:1.

    Against a lot of other players I'm folding because I wouldn't expect them to *ever* play AK like this.

    Also w worse pot odds I'm folding... Call relies on the fact that we only need to be good 20% of the time...
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