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Oh, what a river

DavidFerrara Posts: 7Member
edited November -1 in NLHE Strategy Discussion
It's a 1/3 game at Wynn, where the max buy-in is 500. Hero covers all villains.

Hero raises to 15 with AdAh utg+1, gets 4 callers.

Flop KT7ccd, hero bets 50, gets two callers.

Turn Th, hero bets 115, they both call again. Caller 1 (relatively new to the table, but seemingly thoughtful) now has 300 behind, while caller 2 (window licker) has 125 behind. (Are we OK with the turn bet size?)

River Kh. Hero?

Conversely, what's the optimal river sizing if we have AK or KQ?

Comments

  • DavidFerrara Posts: 7Member
    In a live setting, is the turn a check-fold?
  • reedmylipsreedmylips Posts: 1,146Subscriber
    DavidFerrara said

    It's a 1/3 game at Wynn, where the max buy-in is 500. Hero covers all villains.

    Hero raises to 15 with AdAh utg+1, gets 4 callers.

    Flop KT7ccd, hero bets 50, gets two callers.

    Turn Th, hero bets 115, they both call again. Caller 1 (relatively new to the table, but seemingly thoughtful) now has 300 behind, while caller 2 (window licker) has 125 behind. (Are we OK with the turn bet size?)

    River Kh. Hero?

    Conversely, what's the optimal river sizing if we have AK or KQ?
    This board sucks ass!!! If the table is passive, then I guess the river is a check fold, as nobody will be value betting A-high or JJ or QQ. The turn is a bet all day, not huge, something exactly like what you bet. You need to get value from kings and from club draws.
  • ThehammahThehammah Posts: 7,090Subscriber
    I agree.. Also to consider is if you or anyone who is overcalling is pot committed by any bet. Then I like the check and fold line against nits and maybe calling against loose aggressive players. The flop is very draw heavy and you are getting called by diamond draws and hands like QJ, 89

    I think the T on the turn is a really good card for you since many players who might have been able to hit a two pair draw don't have that anymore and if you get raised I think its a pretty easy fold.

    If you had AK or KQ with over $500 in the pot $15*3 preflop, $150 on flop, $345 on turn =45+150+345 = 540

    You can bet either go for gold and shove or value bet relatively small.. This is dependent on the ranges of the villains .. If you think they have a K then go for gold. If you think they have a T or 7s full and slow-playing then valuebet..

    Wendy
  • grindbler Posts: 131Member
    its hard to get value from QJ on the river by betting out.
    I can't think of a value-hand that we can extract value from, really... (QQ/ JJ ?... i don't think so, and handreading tells us these are so unlikely)

    since the only value hand that beats us that might fold is 77, turning AA into a bluff here is really bad.
    their ranges have to include enough Ks and Ts to make this a turbo check fold.
    at this level very few are turning a counterfeited small pair into a bluff, and they don't show up with one anyways as played too often; so i wouldnt be hoping to snap off bluffs here. If a villian had QJ, it's a horrible spot to be bluffing too, and most are pretty str8forward...


    K2-Ak are the same hand on the river, so if we actually held that, I would bet @1/3 pot and hope someone has a T, or a poorly played 77?
  • wildncrazyguywildncrazyguy Posts: 422Subscriber
    As aggressive as I am sometimes I actually think the turn is a chk and maybe fold in a 1-3 game. The reason is in this level of a game if both people have a draw they will chk, rarely will either bet in this spot in a 1-3 game on a draw. Of course everything is villian dependant and if one of them or both is aggressive thats different. If it goes chk chk bet I might call the turn bet and chk fold the river or block bet depending on the villian but when the 10 comes on the turn even a guy with a K in these games will normally chk scared that someone hit trips. If you do bet turn river is a clear check fold unless you get a strong read that the 2 people in didn't like the draw coming in - than you can bluff. In an online 6 max game now forget what I said since people call down real light online but live is different.
  • ILYA Posts: 129Subscriber
    Turn sizing: should be smaller. You are betting while prepared to bet/fold. Only a Ten or a boat will raise you on that turn. So bet $75 into 170, instead of 115. All hands that don't have you beat now (on the turn) are drawing almost dead... so you want a call.
    River is a check/fold as no one will bluff you there.
    If you had a K, river is about a 1/3 pot bet.
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