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ZambrotA w/ SHOWDOWN MONKEY tendencies...BAD LINE with Monster flop... Hand A ♠️ J ♠️.

ZambrotAZambrotA Posts: 372Subscriber
edited July 2016 in NLHE Strategy Discussion
$5/5 nlhe live cash game in Los Angeles, Buy in is from $300 to $1000. Normal table dynamic, Hero is new player to the table. STRADDLE POT.

HERO, UTG2, A ♠️ J ♠️ , $1K, new to the table, 1st hand really played after just folding few hands PF.

Villain1, $3K, BB, White Man on his mid 50s, very likely VIP (fun player), wearing a suit, not very regular in the game as i haven’t seems him in the last couple of weeks. I guess he was winning as he has 600bbs and the max buy in is 200bbs.

Villain2, CO, ~$1k, Reg in the last few weeks, white English man on his mid 20s, tight taking his spots mostly IP and likely competent as he is grinding this game everyday and buys 200bbs.
No specific reads but i’ve seen him playing mostly ABC the last couple days.


PREFLOP, STRADDLE $10 from UTG, HERO opens $30 UTG2 with A ♠️ J ♠️ , 4 players call. CO, SB, BB and UTG.



FLOP, 5pls, ~$150, A ♣️ 2 ♠️ 7 ♠️


3 checks to H which also checks, V2 (CO) bets $100, V1 (BB) and H both call.

-TBH i can’t remember why i checked that and i don’t like my check here. (this hand 1 to 2 weeks ago)
After V2 betting and V1 flatting i thought the best was also flatting as i have the "board covered” but i still don’t know if this was the right reason or if it’s a good thought…

I’m ranging V2 on at least top pair or a FD here OTF. very unlikely to be air betting into 4 pls.
V1 can have any pair imo, FDs and even a hand like K ♣️ J ♣️ with couple backdoors.

1)- Check this flop with only 1 player IP when checked to me, pretty bad right??
2)- As played, flatting the $100 is ok or would you check/raise now??


TURN, 3pls, $450, 7 ♦️

V2, H and V1 all check.

-Once i played the flop that way, i was lost just “auto pilot” checking to the agressor.

3)- Would you bet here?


RIVER, 3pls, $450, Q ♦️

V1 checks, HERO???
4)- Would you bet this river and how much and why?



FINAL BOARD A ♣️ 2 ♠️ 7 ♠️ 7 ♦️ Q ♦️
POT $450, H $870, V1 $2870, V2 $870

Comments

  • MikeG Posts: 989Subscriber
    edited July 2016
    I'd bet flop and turn and check river.

    As played, I don't actually like a check-raise here, even though it is a very common play. The problem with a C/R is a lot of time the money ends up going in and then you have a problem. Since you have the A it means other people can't have it. So, with all of the action, are you likely to be up against worse flushes? Not often enough. So what are the other hands you get it in against? Better aces, sets, and maybe a weird 2p type hand. On the contrary, if we just bet originally or just call a bet, then we keep worse flush draws in and leave ourselves the chance to flush over flush someone.

    As played on river, I'm probably just check-calling. I don't see a purpose to betting -- in fact, I'm not even sure if we're betting as a bluff or for value.
  • MrSpecial Posts: 330Subscriber
    Dont like the flat here on the flop and if you did it back then for deceptive reasons I feel you missed out on value and brought yourself in an unnecesary spot. I can see both: check turn and bet river or bet turn and check river.

    As played, check call the river and give V a chance to bluff a missed flush or another way to play i could see is a big check raise to get players of a chop. This is really dependant on V tendency to play Ax. Does he bet an A on turn or check behind?

    because we are not heads up and the chance of one of them having a 7 is higher, I would probably just check call the river. If it were heads up and we had more infos on V I could see the checkr aise being better.
  • BartBart Posts: 5,820AdministratorLeadPro
    edited July 2016
    Once the turn gets checked through and BB checks river there literally is no hand that can beat us except if CO was slowplaying 77 or 22. I don't see him checking back AQ on the turn, all that often. However, our kicker doesn't play so its not like we can get a call and win--unless players are so bad that they may call with Q X I like a check at the end and an evaluation...

    Flop I am betting here with a very high frequency. We have so much equity and vs hands that might be ahead like AK and AQ and we build up the pot with the nut draw. It might be different if we had say A3ss or something where a flop call might be hard to get called by worse..

    Bart
  • Letmewin1 Posts: 1,238Member
    I would probably size my open pre to around $40-$50.
    Flop-should be a bet always.
    River-Once turn checks through we could take either a c/c line or bet to try to fold out chops, obviously bet/folding since there is a slight chance that CO filled up OTT and was in a trapy mood.
  • pokertime Posts: 2,180Subscriber
    Agree with others. I would almost always bet flop here. On occasion I might do a delayed turn cbet if I think seomeone will view that as a bluff stab and call with worse. The problem with that here is they are likley to give you credit for a flush with this many players and fold if turn is a spade. As played river is a bet. Your so under repped bro! :cool: JK as Bart said kicker doesn't play so I probably just check call based on who bets and how much. One of those note to self don't do this again hands.
  • Arenzano Posts: 1,391Subscriber
    I would take a bet/bet/bet line.

    As played once the turn is checked through, I would bet / fold something like $125 on the river targeting Qx.
  • ClockClock Posts: 1,097Subscriber
    edited July 2016
    I don't like the line at all (I would be betting this flop all day long), but as played I would x/r this river as a bluff to get V2 to lay down a chop.
    If he's decent he might v-bet an Ace thinly here and if he doesn't have an Ace we're not getting paid anyway so I don't see a point in betting...
  • BananaStandBananaStand Posts: 1,455Troll
    Apparently Zambrota has a policy where he only shares results with people who post in the thread. So here I am.

  • Rocketman74Rocketman74 Posts: 451Subscriber
    I don't get the check on the flop (but neither do you lol)

    TBH, not sure if I x-r the flop after the bet and the call (as I just can't wrap my head around the check.)

    as played... I'm checking and calling V1 most of the time and probably still overcalling if V2 calls first.)
  • ZambrotAZambrotA Posts: 372Subscriber
    MikeG said:
    I'd bet flop and turn and check river.

    As player, I don't actually like a check-raise here, even though it is a very common play. The problem with a C/R is a lot of time the money ends up going in and then you have a problem. Since you have the A it means other people can't have it. So, with all of the action, are you likely to be up against worse flushes? Not often enough. So what are the other hands you get it in against? Better aces, sets, and maybe a weird 2p type hand. On the contrary, if we just bet originally or just call a bet, then we keep worse flush draws in and leave ourselves the chance to flush over flush someone.

    As played on river, I'm probably just check-calling. I don't see a purpose to betting -- in fact, I'm not even sure if we're betting as a bluff or for value.
    i like your line.
    I also don't as it makes likely the worse hands to fold and the better to call.
    I agree with everything you said.
    ty
  • ZambrotAZambrotA Posts: 372Subscriber
    MrSpecial said:
    Dont like the flat here on the flop and if you did it back then for deceptive reasons I feel you missed out on value and brought yourself in an unnecesary spot. I can see both: check turn and bet river or bet turn and check river.

    As played, check call the river and give V a chance to bluff a missed flush or another way to play i could see is a big check raise to get players of a chop. This is really dependant on V tendency to play Ax. Does he bet an A on turn or check behind?

    because we are not heads up and the chance of one of them having a 7 is higher, I would probably just check call the river. If it were heads up and we had more infos on V I could see the checkr aise being better.
    I don't hate the flat OTF but i don't like not betting.
    About your question, OTT we all 3 checked so i guess not as he didn't do it.
    x/c OTR seems good to me.
    ty
  • ZambrotAZambrotA Posts: 372Subscriber
    Bart said:
    Once the turn gets checked through and BB checks river there literally is no hand that can beat us except if CO was slowplaying 77 or 22. I don't see him checking back AQ on the turn, all that often. However, our kicker doesn't play so its not like we can get a call and win--unless players are so bad that they may call with Q X I like a check at the end and an evaluation...

    Flop I am betting here with a very high frequency. We have so much equity and vs hands that might be ahead like AK and AQ and we build up the pot with the nut draw. It might be different if we had say A3ss or something where a flop call might be hard to get called by worse..

    Bart
    Ya OTF i really messed up all the hand. Yesterday looking at my notes posting the hand, i was like "but why check OTF 2nd last to act?!?!!?!? WTF!!
    But i try to post the hands which i felt lost or miss played then i choosed this one.
    I agree with the reasons of betting OTF.
    ty Bart
  • ZambrotAZambrotA Posts: 372Subscriber
    Letmewin1 said:
    I would probably size my open pre to around $40-$50.
    Flop-should be a bet always.
    River-Once turn checks through we could take either a c/c line or bet to try to fold out chops, obviously bet/folding since there is a slight chance that CO filled up OTT and was in a trapy mood.
    I agree with your sizing PF. The thing i do is when i get to a table, before i start feeling what's going on, i avoid going to hard and it's why i make it "the minimum" bc i still don't have info enough of what i really want to achieve with my raise.
    OTF bet for sure.
    River agreed.
    ty
  • ZambrotAZambrotA Posts: 372Subscriber
    pokertime said:
    Agree with others. I would almost always bet flop here. On occasion I might do a delayed turn cbet if I think seomeone will view that as a bluff stab and call with worse. The problem with that here is they are likley to give you credit for a flush with this many players and fold if turn is a spade. As played river is a bet. Your so under repped bro! :cool: JK as Bart said kicker doesn't play so I probably just check call based on who bets and how much. One of those note to self don't do this again hands.
    Ya bet flop for sure!
    delayed Cbet OTT doesn't sound bad.
    The problem with the bet OTR is what worse can we get called by?!?
    ty
  • ZambrotAZambrotA Posts: 372Subscriber
    Arenzano said:
    I would take a bet/bet/bet line.

    As played once the turn is checked through, I would bet / fold something like $125 on the river targeting Qx.
    I don't mind the bet bet bet but pot will be huge OTR.
    As you didn't mention numbers i leave it like that.
    AP, OTR $125 doesn't sound crazy, the only issue is inducing bluffs which are rare OTR but who knows as we are inducing them betting less than a third of the pot.
    ty
  • ZambrotAZambrotA Posts: 372Subscriber
    Clock said:
    I don't like the line at all (I would be betting this flop all day long), but as played I would x/r this river as a bluff to get V2 to lay down a chop.
    If he's decent he might v-bet an Ace thinly here and if he doesn't have an Ace we're not getting paid anyway so I don't see a point in betting...
    You have good reasons to unlike the line bc i also don't like it.
    bet OTF for sure.
    x/r OTR has merit. Turn TP into a bluff is not something i do but i have to give you credit. As Bart mentions sometimes to get chop hands to fold.
    ty
  • ZambrotAZambrotA Posts: 372Subscriber
    BananaStand said:
    Apparently Zambrota has a policy where he only shares results with people who post in the thread. So here I am.

    I'm sure you know better @BanaStand
  • ZambrotAZambrotA Posts: 372Subscriber
    Rocketman74 said:
    I don't get the check on the flop (but neither do you lol)

    TBH, not sure if I x-r the flop after the bet and the call (as I just can't wrap my head around the check.)

    as played... I'm checking and calling V1 most of the time and probably still overcalling if V2 calls first.)
    ya x OTF VERY WEAK!!
    x/r this flop it's something that i don't think is good bc tends to fold worse and get called by better.
    ty
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